The Dishonest Pursuit of Truth

Posts: 1

Madthumbs,

You sent me a friend request on MySpace which I accepted. I checked out your page which I found to be quite objectionable so I left a comment (which has been reposted below). I noticed that you left me a comment in return, but I was unable to respond as it appears that I was summarily dropped from your "Friend's" list. So here I am posting my response on your forum (I have included the original correspondence as well for reference since it was deleted from your MySpace account).

thedigimess:
Evangelical claims of "real truth" naturally raise red flags. Truth is not a position, it is a process. Anyone who claims to have "The Truth," especially when dealing in controversial subjects, typically can more accurately be said to have an agenda. The most reliable knowledge comes from the application of the scientific method. Facts are not steadfast, but are subject to constant revision and are guided by the unrelenting and unbiased exploration of new and ever changing evidence. In my quick review of this page and its affiliated sites I am led to believe that this is not a movement based on science, but rather it is informed by a philosophy of fanaticism. Fanaticism is the enemy of science and provides a fertile breeding ground for irrational ideas. I am not hopeful that this page would be helpful in providing anything approaching truth, it appears instead to be mongering paranoid conspiracy theories and racist propaganda.

Madthumbs:
I'm anti-racist. I make it clear that religion is the problem.

thedigimess:
You make it clear that you are anti-Jew. You may try to skirt it around by proclaiming that Judaism is a religion and not a race, but that hardly diminishes the fact that you harbor deep-seated prejudices and that you have an extremely biased agenda.

Where the facts are left wanting, as they clearly are in your proclamations and in your “resource material,” misdirection is often employed as a means to derail the conversation. If I had taken the bait on your anti-racist proclamation I suppose I could have been drawn into a discussion of whether are not Jews are part of a race. Rather than admit to your prejudices we would have been bogged down by a discussion of semantics.

You offer a complete translated text of The Protocols of the Elders of Zion on your site (as a resource!) without so much as a mention of the fact that the document was thoroughly exposed as a hoax as far back as 1920!* How can you be trusted as someone prepared to engage in honest dialog? You have no regard for facts or evidence or even so much as an interest in the honest and dispassionate pursuit of knowledge. You are completely and utterly without credibility.

Even if I grant you the ridiculous claim that you are NOT a racist, the evidence still points to the fact that you are an ignorant, anti-intellectual, hateful bigot.

Reference:
*(http://skepdic.com/protocols.html)
The Protocols were exposed as a forgery by Lucien Wolf in The Jewish Bogey and the Forged Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion (London: Press Committee of the Jewish Board of Deputies, 1920). In 1921, Philip Graves, a correspondent for the London Times, publicized the forgery. Herman Bernstein in The Truth About "The Protocols of Zion": A Complete Exposure (1935) also tried and failed to convince the world of the forgery.

Posts: 8187

It's clear all you're hear to do is smear. You had your voice; now your banned.

Judaism is racist, Christianity is racist. Is exposing these racist tools racist propaganda?

Woohoo I'm anti-Jew. Actually I'm anti-Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, etc. Why did you pick "jew"? Rolling Eyes

I'm not anti-people: I'm anti-religion.

You may try to skirt around the by proclaiming I have a biased agenda by ignoring the fact that there are other religions I oppose too.

	Quote:
	You offer a complete translated text of The Protocols of the Elders of Zion on your site (as a resource!) without so much as a mention of the fact that the document was thoroughly exposed as a hoax as far back as 1920!*

Funny, if this was your only issue. I just updated the page to address the allegation of it being a hoax.

	Quote:
	How can you be trusted as someone prepared to engage in honest dialog?

I'm not the one smearing you on your site with baseless accusations and name calling am I? People like you can find your own platform.

Posts: 226

	madthumbs wrote:
	It's clear all you're hear to do is smear. You had your voice; now your banned.

Sorry to butt in here Madthumbs, but it may have been wise to debate this person rather than ban him/her.

The reason is that this person has obviously not been very intelligent on the study of the Protolcols, because to be a forgery there must have been an original to forge, to be plagiarized there had to be an original to plagiarized from.

Regardless of the arguments to deny the protocols there must have been 'an original', and if the original didn't proclaim all the things in the existing proltocols today it means they have been 'refined' ... The important issue is that they do indeed EXIST, and they also reflect what has and is happening in all of society, world wide, TODAY.

Therfore "There can be NO logical or meaningful denial"

Just my 2c.

Posts: 8187

I don't have time to deal with everyone that comes here acting as if we're anti-semite, racist, bigots, etc.

These people aren't really here to debate, teach, or learn. They're just here to attack. I've got better things to do than address these smear campaigns. If they had a point to make: they'd do it in their first post. The rest would be nit-picking and bickering. Like I say: they had their voice.

I would say that if we were so hateful, etc... then why does it need pointing out?...Then I think of Daryl Bradford Smith and company which WE exposed as racist propaganda. Many people had called him racist, but gave no basis for the claim.

Posts: 185

Protocols of the Elders of Zion are sexual intercourse real bitch and you know it!

Posts: 819

	Quote:
	Woohoo I'm anti-Jew. Actually I'm anti-Judaism, Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, etc. Why did you pick "jew"? I'm not anti-people: I'm anti-religion. You may try to skirt around the by proclaiming I have a biased agenda by ignoring the fact that there are other religions I oppose too.

almost my exact words a few days ago to someone saying i was anti-semitic..

'well, yeah.. but no.. semitic is the wrong word, but what you're basically trying to say, ie anti-judaism is pretty much true.. so what? big deal!'

i am anti-judaism! (Judah-ism)

because it is a religion based on segregation of a tribe, the belief that it is a superior people..
it is a religion based on fear, terror, hate and revenge.

how could anyonbe read 'ezekiel' and not see that?

and i am anti-hate, anti-fear, anti-racist.. unfortunately when you brainwash a baby believing this junk, especially with such a politically, literary and monetarily powerful cult, it's hard to talk sense to them let alone unbrainwash them.

judaism is madness.
(and scares the crap out of me).

i'm pretty much anti-religion, but there are some things i admire in some such as buddhism and christianity (even if he didn't exist, jesus's sermon on the mount blows away the whole old testament)...

i really can't find much to admire about judah-ism. sue me.

Posts: 2596

Awakened from your slumber. Welcome back!

Posts: 819

thanks ed

i had to go on a self-given exile. and just after i got back i needed a madthumbs-given exile.

back now, and i'll be around here and there, now and then..

cheers mate.

Posts: 445

good to have you back here mate! long time no see.

Posts: 8187

Glad to have you back! Missed your beautifully worded posts!

Posts: 519

from what I understand, you left juat as I jumped on board. I have read alot of your posts, enjoyed them and looking forward for more.

any-hoo, like I told my grandfather (who is concerned that I will go to hell for denying Christ), religon is the far most divisible craft ever known to mankind, and we all suffer because of it.

<--- vomits on shoe d'oh!

Posts: 12

So, where's God [the ultimate source of intelligent reasons] in your paradigm -- if the Church is bereft of good sense?

Just wondered.

Myself, I have a hard time finding a parish or congregation that isn't going through the steps and wishfully thinking nice thoughts.

So, I stay out.

Em