Joined: 22 Feb 2006 Posts: 8235 Location: Fingerlakes - NY usa
USS Liberty
The crew aboard USS Liberty in 1967 witnessed Israel having Egyptian POW's dig mass graves for themselves (A war crime defying the Geneva Conventions Article 13). You can hear Jim Ennes an eye witness survivor of the attack describe this event: Prisoners’ Massacre. To cover up this war crime, Israel may have attacked USS Liberty in an attempt to kill the witness's or it was a false flag operation to provoke the US into joining them in their war with Egypt, or both. LBJ - President of the US at the time was complicit in the cover up of these crimes.
AMERICAN LEADERS SUPPORT USS Liberty SURVIVORS
The Israeli government, the AntiDefamation League, and
certain notorious apologists for Israel insist that the attack was
a tragic accident and that the US government accepts that assertion.
Not so. Virtually every knowledgeable American official with
the lone exception of Robert McNamara is on public record
calling the attack deliberate and the Israeli story untrue.
Here are a few of those American leaders.
"I was never satisfied with the Israeli explanation. . . . Through diplomatic channels we refused to accept their explanations. I didn't believe them then, and I don't believe them to this day. The attack was outrageous "
-- US Secretary of State Dean Rusk
"...the board of inquiry (concluded) that the Israelis knew exactly what they were doing in attacking the Liberty."
-- CIA Director Richard Helms
"I can tell you for an absolute certainty (from intercepted communications) that the Israelis knew they were attacking an American ship."
-- NSA Deputy Director Oliver Kirby
"That the Liberty could have been mistaken for the Egyptian supply ship El Quseir is unbelievable"
-- Special Assistant to the President Clark Clifford, in his report to President Lyndon Johnson
"The highest officials of the [Johnson] administration, including the President, believed it 'inconceivable' that Israel's 'skilled' defense forces could have committed such a gross error."
-- Lyndon Johnson's biographer Robert Dallek in Flawed Giant, Oxford University Press, 1998, pp. 430-31)
"A nice whitewash for a group of ignorant, stupid and inept [expletive deleted]."
-- Handwritten note of August 26, 1967, by NSA Deputy Director Louis W. Tordella reacting to the Israeli court decision exonerating Israelis of blame for the Liberty attack.
"Never before in the history of the United States Navy has a Navy Board of Inquiry ignored the testimony of American military eyewitnesses and taken, on faith, the word of their attackers.
-- Captain Richard F. Kiepfer, Medical Corps, US Navy (retired), USS Liberty Survivor
"The evidence was clear. Both Admiral Kidd and I believed with certainty that this attack...was a deliberate effort to sink an American ship and murder its entire crew.... It was our shared belief. . .that the attack. . .could not possibly have been an accident.... I am certain that the Israeli pilots [and] their superiors. . .were well aware that the ship was American."
-- Captain Ward Boston, JAGC, US Navy (retired), senior legal counsel to the US Navy Court of Inquiry
That the attack was deliberate "just wasn't a disputed issue" within the National Security Agency
-- Former NSA Director retired Army Lieutenant General William Odom on 3 March 2003 in an interview for Naval Institute Proceedings
Former NSA/CIA Director Admiral Bobby Inman "flatly rejected" the Cristol/Israeli claims that the attack was an accident
-- 5 March 2003 interview for Naval Institute Proceedings
Of four former NSA/CIA seniors with inside knowledge, none was aware of any agency official who dissented from the position that the attack was deliberate
-- David Walsh, writing in Naval Institute Proceedings
"It appears to me that it was not a pure case of mistaken identity."
-- Captain William L. McGonagle, Commanding Officer, USS Liberty, speaking at Arlington National Cemetery, June 8, 1997
"To suggest that they [the IDF] couldn't identify the ship is ... ridiculous. ... Anybody who could not identify the Liberty could not tell the difference between the White House and the Washington Monument."
-- Admiral Thomas Moorer, Chief of Naval Operations and later Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff, quoted in The Washington Post, June 15, 1991, p. 14
Alex shifting blame still does not convince me that he is a Zionist. In the conference he spoke in, he did mention Israel is a puppet or front and he has also blamed them for committing crimes as well.
Now I am still uninformed on the USS Liberty so I will have to take a look at some of your information. I did check out the USS Liberty website and they claim that it is not important to figure out why Israel attacked them... I wonder why?
Also I just can't figure out a clear reason why Isreal would do it for their own benefit. Neither can I figure out why Alex thinks it benefited the US.
Sun Sep 10, 2006 11:56 am
madthumbs
Joined: 22 Feb 2006 Posts: 8235 Location: Fingerlakes - NY usa
What is it with Alex Jones fans that start arguing before researching?
to attack with unmarked planes the ship - kill everyone off and blame it on egyptians (israel was in war with egypt) to make americans attack egypt.
there was also execution of egyptian prisoners of war which folks on uss liberty were observing.
writing this for gazillionth time in forums.
you probably won't find more evidence about alex on any other site,
if it's still not enough for you
- do you feel like you have enough brains to stand up to Zionists?
to attack with unmarked planes the ship - kill everyone off and blame it on egyptians (israel was in war with egypt) to make americans attack egypt.
there was also execution of egyptian prisoners of war which folks on uss liberty were observing.
writing this for gazillionth time in forums.
you probably won't find more evidence about alex on any other site,
if it's still not enough for you
- do you feel like you have enough brains to stand up to Zionists?
thanks for the explanation, it clears things up a lot.
Now my next question is, how does this make Alex a Zionist? He still said Israel was a puppet. He may wrong or whatever, but how does a man that is against Israel be considered a Zionist?
1.Alex Jones Honorary Member RSICC
2.Alex Jones Denies Israel Carried Out 911
3.Alex Jones Denies Zionist Involvement On USS Liberty
4.Alex Jones blames Luciferians
5.Alex Jones brings out C.Sheen as 911 exposer
6.So called "father" of truth movement was lying to us 10 years about Zionists and Israel, instead blaming "elite, satan, illuminati etc"?
How long did it take YOU to find out about Zionism?
1.Alex Jones Honorary Member RSICC
2.Alex Jones Denies Israel Carried Out 911
3.Alex Jones Denies Zionist Involvement On USS Liberty
4.Alex Jones blames Luciferians
5.Alex Jones brings out C.Sheen as 911 exposer
6.So called "father" of truth movement was lying to us 10 years about Zionists and Israel, instead blaming "elite, satan, illuminati etc"?
How long did it take YOU to find out about Zionism?
What is then a difference between people who think "Bush and Neocons are just stupid to make 911 happen" and people who think "Alex Jones is just stupid to not see Zionists everywhere"?
Same thing goes for his whole crowd.
This is my last response on this.
Sun Sep 10, 2006 3:03 pm
madthumbs
Joined: 22 Feb 2006 Posts: 8235 Location: Fingerlakes - NY usa
Lets waste no more time explaining Alex to mediaismindrape. The evidence is there. Don't ignore it then question it. You have your answers. If you want to be ignorant; you can express it somewhere else.
to attack with unmarked planes the ship - kill everyone off and blame it on egyptians (israel was in war with egypt) to make americans attack egypt.
there was also execution of egyptian prisoners of war which folks on uss liberty were observing.
writing this for gazillionth time in forums.
you probably won't find more evidence about alex on any other site,
if it's still not enough for you
- do you feel like you have enough brains to stand up to Zionists?
Now Ben you must explain your self when you say "To make americans (America) attack Egypt when DBS states
"America was fighting the Vietnam War at the time, so starting a war in the Middle East would mean the USA would have to fight two very big wars."
Frm DBS stated position that would not be a good thing to do. Correct?
So why would you give the explanation as "To make Americans (America) attack Egypt?" when fighting two very big wars would not be a wise thing to do.
I have already stated that to fight two very big wars would be a great profit to the "Private Bankers" because war means money to them.
Sun Sep 10, 2006 5:30 pm
Sponsor
madthumbs
Joined: 22 Feb 2006 Posts: 8235 Location: Fingerlakes - NY usa
I think it was more about the war crimes witnessed, and the attack would drum support for Israel's war.
I think it was more about the war crimes witnessed, and the attack would drum support for Israel's war.
Yea I have heard the theory, but again what advantage would america be in to attack Egypt? Another World War?
I don't think that anyone in america would have been inclined to support another WW, or a war with Egypt. The only people who would have benifitted from war would be power hungry money men.They would have known that another war would have been a blow to the Economy allowing them to buy off companies a cut rate prices and allowing them to turn around and make billions of dollars of of others misery.
The war crimes "witnessed" could have been controlled through the very same command that was give to the soldiers on board about liberty.
Mon Sep 11, 2006 5:25 am
Cyrus the Shepherd
Joined: 28 Aug 2006 Posts: 237 Location: Lake Geneva, Wisconsin
Attack on Egypt is motivated by hatred of God's holy land.(which is in "Egypt")
This is why US was covertly, subordinately operating with Zionists to fight Egypt. Wag the dog.
Their main mission is to destroy God's Promised Land. (Egypt, or Israel to be overt.)
But God will not allow this to happen.
Mon Sep 11, 2006 5:37 am
Sponsor
madthumbs
Joined: 22 Feb 2006 Posts: 8235 Location: Fingerlakes - NY usa
For former US seaman Gary Brummett, the 40th anniversary of the 1967 Middle East war has stirred painful memories.
As a 21-year-old third class petty officer, Mr Brummett was serving on board the USS Liberty off the coast of Egypt on 8 June, when, without warning, the vessel came under fire, first from fighter planes, then torpedo boats.
The attack, which lasted at least 40 minutes, resulted in the deaths of 34 of Mr Brummett's fellow crewmen, at least 170 injured and catastrophic damage to the ship.
Alarmingly, the assault had been carried out not by enemy forces, but by the US' closest regional ally, Israel.
Israel insists it mistook the Liberty for a hostile Egyptian ship, the El Quseir, and numerous US and Israeli inquiries have concluded the attack was accidental.
But for Mr Brummett and a growing body of conspiracy theorists, the authorities are guilty of a cover-up.
"I have more trouble with it today than when it happened because I know more of the facts about what was going on," said Mr Brummett.
"There's been an egregious wrong done here, there's been an extreme number of lies told to the American people and the American people do not know the truth about what happened."
'Sitting duck'
The attack on the Liberty - the gravest incident in the history of US-Israeli relations - has been a source of controversy for the past four decades.
Claim and counter-claim as to what happened have been fought out in every corner of the media, with the advent of the internet helping to reinvigorate the debate.
Israel's supporters say the incident is merely being used as a tool by critics to malign the Jewish state, while accusers say the attack was a war crime which has never come to light.
According to Israel, the incident was a tragic case of friendly fire occurring in the fog of war.
It says it believed the ship had been bombarding Israeli forces fighting in the Sinai, and that its pilots did not see any US flags (survivors say there were three) on the vessel before they opened fire.
Sceptics however claim the attack was premeditated and that the truth has been suppressed. The assertion of a cover-up was lent weight by a 2003 independent commission of inquiry which reported that the attack on the Liberty "remains the only serious naval incident that has never been thoroughly investigated by Congress".
Among the most popular theories as to why Israel would take such drastic action against its superpower ally is that the Liberty, a $40m state-of-the-art surveillance ship, was eavesdropping on an Israeli massacre of Egyptian prisoners of war.
Israel strongly denies its troops executed Egyptian POWs, saying those who died in an incident at that time were 250 armed Palestinian fighters killed in action.
Another is that the ship had learnt of secret Israeli plans to invade Syria's Golan Heights two days later and had to be destroyed.
'US collusion' theory
Perhaps the most sinister motive is that put forward by journalist Peter Hounam in his 2003 book "Operation Cyanide".
Mr Hounam claims secret elements within the US and Israeli governments colluded to bomb the ship and blame the attack on Egypt and their superpower ally, the Soviet Union, triggering massive retaliation which would ensure Israeli victory.
"The attack on the Liberty was pre-planned, perhaps from at least a year beforehand," Mr Hounam says.
"The Liberty was sent into a very dangerous situation, where it was, in my view, placed in a position to be attacked."
Mr Hounam says the intention was to sink the ship and kill everyone on board, but as the Liberty remained afloat the plan was aborted and has been hushed up ever since.
'Presidential order'
Successive US and Israeli inquiries, and the declassification of thousands of pieces of information, have done little to dampen suspicions.
One of the most powerful claims of a cover-up has come from retired US Navy lawyer Capt Ward Boston, counsel to the Navy Court of Inquiry into the incident conducted just days after the event.
Capt Boston says the court's original findings, which he signed, were changed afterwards by government lawyers.
He also claims the president of the court, Rear Adm Isaac Kidd, told him he was ordered by US President Lyndon Johnson and Defence Secretary Robert McNamara to conclude the attack was a case of mistaken identity.
However, Capt Boston's version of events - and the notion that what happened was anything more than a tragic accident - are disputed by numerous academics and authors who have investigated the incident.
"It was a series of blunders by both the United States and Israel that resulted in a terrible tragedy and nothing more," says Jay Cristol, a federal judge and author of the book The Liberty Incident.
"All the official reports came to the same conclusion.
"Unfortunately there are a number of people who are on the other side of the Arab-Israeli conflict who think this is a way to attack the otherwise very strong relationship between the US and Israel, and they keep stirring the pot.
'No evidence'
It is a view with which historian Michael B Oren, a senior fellow at the Shalem Center, a Jerusalem academic research institute, concurs.
"Many thousands of documents related to the Liberty have been declassified and in none of these documents will you find a scintilla of evidence to suggest any of these conspiracy theories are true," he says.
"The Golan one is the easiest to disprove because of where the Liberty was, not off the coast of Israel, but Egypt. Its listening devices weren't that powerful that they could listen in on communications in Tel Aviv.
"Moreover the Israelis were very upfront in telling the US that they planned to capture the Golan Heights and the Americans agreed to it.
"Regarding a massacre of Egyptian POWs, there's no evidence of that. And why would the Israelis try to cover up one atrocity by committing another?
He says the attack has remained a source of controversy because "it has all the ingredients of a good spy scandal. It involves espionage and it involves the Israelis, who are forever a focus of conspiracy theories.
"If I could prove the Liberty was attacked in a premeditated fashion, I would write it - it would be a great historical scoop - but the truth is far more mundane."
Sat Jun 09, 2007 5:34 pm
madthumbs
Joined: 22 Feb 2006 Posts: 8235 Location: Fingerlakes - NY usa
Execution of Egyptian Captives by Israel in 1967
Quote:
A part from the Israeli film which shows the execution of Egyptian prisoners of war, some of those were civilans and workers but Israel didn't differntiate. All were killed with cold blood.
This film was broadcasted in the Egyptian talkshow (10 O'Clock العاشرة مساءاً) presented by Mona Al-Shazli who narrates in Arabic what the Israeli War Generals said in the film about their attrocities.
